Curse

Gumby · Dec 18, 2006, 04:33 AM // 04:33

I know what your thinking,
but hear me out.

Ranger Spike

There is definatley enough damage, there would probably be enough damage if the Rits had 0 marksmanship. Tell me what you think.
(BTW, I know you all think spike is lame and I should play something thats not a spike.. like Eurospike, lol)
If you have any questions or whatever, just ask them.

P.S. I was thinking of changing the Paragon to /Mes and have him bring Shatterstorm instead of "Incoming!"
P.S.2. Lookin for a better elite than Peace And Harmony for the Bonder, so if you have any suggestions, let me hear em.

Dragannia · Dec 18, 2006, 04:36 AM // 04:36

God I faced this team the other day. Though they were using 3 Rits. It's annoying and brutal.

Phoenix Arrows · Dec 18, 2006, 04:39 AM // 04:39

Perhaps Boon Signet or Signet of Removal on the Bonder?

dansamy · Dec 18, 2006, 04:49 AM // 04:49

I am gonna leave this open for now, although I am 90% certain JR will lock it when he sees it.

Gumby · Dec 18, 2006, 05:20 AM // 05:20

Man he's so mean.
Why would he lock my leetsauce rspike? xD

dansamy · Dec 18, 2006, 07:34 AM // 07:34

Probably because it sucks?

There's a reason no one runs a bonder in GvG anymore.

Gumby · Dec 18, 2006, 09:04 AM // 09:04

It doesnt suck. And nobody runs a bonder in GvG any more because theres no room for one in their build.
With all the Eurospike goin around I think a bonder would be good.
look at PnH vs. Cel in round 1.. cel only got like 4 kills that match cuz they were running angelic bond.
And like I said before, I garuntee the spike is enough to kill somebody.

Lightbulb · Dec 18, 2006, 09:12 AM // 09:12

Which is?

Is it fair to lock a thread 'because it sucks'. Personally i think tripple SF with thumpers is/was pretty lame but would thta kinda thread get locked.

Just because its R Spike not the normal way it gets locked. If you don't want to help the guy just let it drop off the bottom.

At least its something innovative. All it would take is for a top 10 team to run this and suddenly Shields Up! would be come one of the most popular skills...

Only thing i would say is it possible to split this? I think not. For me the best spikes are still deadly on the split - just gives alot more options. Not sure what you could do to make it better. 4 Rangers, drop the bonder drop the paragon might do it. But even then not sure...

Patrograd · Dec 18, 2006, 09:57 AM // 09:57

I think its a nice enough concept, although I would drop the bonder for more damage through another rit, or some better damage mitigation than bonds like another paragon (who can also have an attack skill or two for added fun)

Couple of comments

Spear of lightning does lightning damage, and so seems unlikely to trigger orders, which seems a shame if thats the case

Not sure you need awaken the blood on the orders and this character is arguably stronger as mesmer primary imo. Why bring shatterstorm? Wouldnt gaze of contempt with other misc enchant hate like denchant or ienchant be stronger?

Also all those superiors are, imo, likely to make your monks want to go and hide in a corner and cry.

JR · Dec 18, 2006, 10:00 AM // 10:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gumby

It doesnt suck. And nobody runs a bonder in GvG any more because theres no room for one in their build.

How does it feel knowing that a single Avatar of Grenth makes one of your characters completely useless?

Patrograd · Dec 18, 2006, 10:41 AM // 10:41

I just had a little mess around on the isles of the nameless, just to see

First thing, the energy on those rits is very, very tight. Without some form of external energy its going to be a long time between spikes. Suggest blood rit on the necro

Second, enchant hate will kill it dead, as JR points out

Thirdly, ouch. Dual/savage for ~220, and thats without orders, without anthem of envy, without GFTE/FTW, without winnowing.

Wonder if theres some better way of abusing this though....

Morgoth the dark · Dec 18, 2006, 11:37 AM // 11:37

well dmg output is impressive - i took out 100 armor with only 2 spikers.
But there is no need to call build rubbish just becuase 1 bonder. You can easily replace that with some other chars ( divert or rt lord).
and yea rt's are quite on tight with energy without expertise so i reccomend BR on necro(and OoV insted expel hexes). And for incoming para - try using Vocal was sogolon rt/pa with incoming, GftE/FtW and some healin / wepon spells instead. Works great

jummeth · Dec 18, 2006, 12:04 PM // 12:04

We ran this with 3Rt/R, a BiP/OoP necro and 3 monks +1.

You shouldn't have spike skills on your necro, the necro should be behind the monks, providing party wide support, and the occasional BiP.

The spikers actually have to think about when and where they want to spike now since they have to be mindful of 3 maintainance things, the prep, the weapon and the enchant.

You might also want to have spare spirits. We found that 2 spikers (damn err7) lost out just slightly vs warriors and sometimes a lucky prot. 3 is almost a definate kill.

Why bother with a bonder? Go with an active healer... like a healers boon or something. BiPed Healers Boon is just insane.

RE: enchant hate, there is a chance, although with a lot of Aegis and OoP spamming, you need to either gaze them or repeatedly remove multiple stacked enchants.

Kabale · Dec 18, 2006, 12:35 PM // 12:35

Quote:

Wonder if theres some better way of abusing this though....

There was pre-EF nerf. But now it's not possible as the energy needed to fuel a spike (not to mention the longest prep ever known to rangerspike!) is way too much. Before the nerf you could get away with having 2 Paragons with a 3E-specced EF, 1 to take care of the spikers, the other for the monks. This, with a few other buffs and something like Godspeed/Fall Back/other speedboost, meant that it could be viable in GvG. But yeah, forget it now. Even with Zealous Anthem it isn't enough as you run out of energy pretty fast.

dansamy · Dec 18, 2006, 01:58 PM // 13:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gumby

It doesnt suck. And nobody runs a bonder in GvG any more because theres no room for one in their build.
With all the Eurospike goin around I think a bonder would be good.
look at PnH vs. Cel in round 1.. cel only got like 4 kills that match cuz they were running angelic bond.
And like I said before, I garuntee the spike is enough to kill somebody.

Bonders lack mobility. No one runs a bonder because you are pretty much stuck with 8v8 and if they split on you, you get screwed. Your build looks ok on paper. In actual practice, against human opponents, you're not gonna have a lot of success.

The Silver Star · Dec 18, 2006, 02:03 PM // 14:03

If your going to run a Bonder you would need a hall like Jade Isle maybe purely because your weak againt splits also 1 Grenth > Bonder.

D Fault · Dec 18, 2006, 02:16 PM // 14:16

With a spike a monk is usually the character sent back vs splits and having bonds with the main group makes it alot easier to survive with just the one 'healer'. Adding extra monks usually helps a teams survivability.

However, as has been pointed out a few times, Avatar of Grenth is to Nightfall what Order of Apostasy was to Factions. No love for the bonder

Could run 2 para, 3 rits.

1 para with Angelic Bond, Aria of Zeal and Zealous Anthem, and the other with Aria of Zeal and Zealous Anthem and a few command buffs.

Rotating the zeals should give the spikers enough energy.

taxed · Dec 18, 2006, 02:23 PM // 14:23

We ran something similar, but very different on the weekend. Let's just say we were able to kill 3-4 players per minute, every minute. We were also able to kill NPC gankers by splitting 2 off, while the flag stand team was able to continue to spike. This means that your lovely Avatar of Grenth will have to fully disable 2 spikers to be effective. This also means that when the spike team is together, we can spike every 10 seconds with a 10-15 second break every minute for recharge. We did DP out 2 teams in about 8 minutes.

jummeth · Dec 18, 2006, 08:24 PM // 20:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kabale

There was pre-EF nerf. But now it's not possible as the energy needed to fuel a spike (not to mention the longest prep ever known to rangerspike!) is way too much. Before the nerf you could get away with having 2 Paragons with a 3E-specced EF, 1 to take care of the spikers, the other for the monks. This, with a few other buffs and something like Godspeed/Fall Back/other speedboost, meant that it could be viable in GvG. But yeah, forget it now. Even with Zealous Anthem it isn't enough as you run out of energy pretty fast.

BiP takes care of the energy easily. Especially if you have an Healer's Boon Monk around.